I think someone was charitable to start a new thread...
There was an article in HVG afterall about comparetive swearing.


>
> In an article > writes:
>
> >Whore  -  kurva
> > rest of vulgarity deleted
>
> I have a feeling that guys like this would be flashers in real life
> except they lack the courage for it.  So the Internet provides an
> alternate where even cowards can play.  Flashing with words, that is.
> Don't you just pity them?
>
> Joe Pannon

I too believe that this discussion is taking up too much space.
Quite frankly, I don't understand why a discussion concerning newsgroups
ended up on this list.

        Norb

Szervusz,
Friend of mine would like to get an English teaching job
in Budapest. She is American citizen. What would be the
right agancy to contact in Budapest for a list of
opportunities ?
Elore is koszonom,
Gotthard

Oops sorry I had thought that the intelligence of those people posting on the
list was above average, but the "gentleman" (Angol shrugging irony) who posted
a list of naughty words must be extremely gifted to be able to type like that.
 Afterall
how many 5 year olds do you know, that have just learned a "naughty word", that
 are
able to type!!!!

I lived on and off for four years (1989-1993) in Budapest, and the naughtiest
 phrase
I learned was "michina Noj Popa" (excuse my phonetical spelling).

Speaking of Humour (yes thats how we spell it!), I thought the piece that Eva
 Durant
posted from the  pages of the "Industrial Worker", newspaper was brilliant. thi
s
 was
worthy of Monty Python at his best. I presume it was meant to be a joke.......


Micky Allen

Well, we certainly don't want our new friend Jutka to leave us! Therefore,
here is a possible thread. Below I will try to outline how I personally see
Hungarian political developments since the elections.

The MSZP promised a government of experts as opposed to the Antall/Boross
government whose members were allegedly amateurs. The MSZP proudly pointed
out that their party, being the successor to the MSZMP, had had vast
experience in governing, and their politicians were more seasoned than those
of the opposition. The MSZP promised cheaper government, more effective
government, faster-acting government. However, it became clear from the very
inception of the Horn government (a coalition government which includes the
SZDSZ) that none of these promises would be fulfilled. The expertise was
simply not there, and the new government was even slower both in enacting
laws and in privatization than its predecessor. The greatest disappointment,
at least as far as I am concerned is Gyula Horn, the prime minister. Although
his political past was checkered because he was on the "wrong side" of the
1956 revolution his reputation was high. This reputation stemmed from the
fact that he held the post of foreign minister during the East German crisis.
At that time the decision was made to allow the thousands and thousands of
East German refugees heading to West Germany to leave Hungary. But one ought
to keep in mind that this was not a decision Horn himself made. First and
foremost, without a nod from Moscow it is unlikely that the Hungarian
government felt free to act. Second, we don't quite know what was going on
within the cabinet during those fateful days. In any case, Horn became a
hero, especially in Germany.

However, during the very first days of the new government it became obvious
that Gyula Horn's temperament stands in the way of effective government. He
is quite autocratic and found the frequent meetings with the leaders of the
SZDSZ on certain issues, a huge bother. Often he even failed to consult with
his fellow party leaders on important issues. He likes to improvise and not a
few "suprises"--contrary to the government program--were pulled out of the
thin air, starting with the tax on wealth to the latest idea of allowing the
two state-owned TV stations to be taken over by groups of people as
concessions for a certain period of time.

But the biggest problem is, as far as I can see it, that Gyula Horn doesn't
seem to understand the serious financial problem Hungary is facing at the
moment. My understanding of it is (and please keep it in mind that I am not
an economist) that Hungary's debt load is so huge that without rapid
privatization of state assets to foreign investors the Hungarian economy
might follow the example of Mexico. The so-called liberal economic policy was
based on rapid privatization and the encouragement of foreign investments.
And it was here that Gyula Horn committed quite a few very serious errors.
First and foremost he intervened in the sale of HungarHotels, a hotel chain
of fourteen hotels, to an American company at the time when the Americans
thought that the deal was pretty well closed. Then, he fired the very
respected head of privatization, Ferenc Bartha. Moreover, he did that while
the minister of finance, Bartha's direct superior and personal friend, was
out of the country. Not surprisingly Laszlo Bekesi resigned and a
close-crisis situation followed, when the country had no finance minister, no
head of privatization, and no head of the National Bank (who had resigned
earlier under pressure from Horn).

Right now at least the posts of finance minister and the head of the National
Bank are filled with two very respectable men, Lajos Bokros and Gyorgy
Suranyi, who are most likely going to continue Bekesi's policies. Horn even
countersigned Bokrosi's 25-point program, saying that he agrees with it. But
knowing what we know about Gyula Horn I wonder how long he will be able to
restrain himself. I find him to be a man whose time has passed. Someone who
is quite bewildered by democracy as well as by the market forces. Although
the media treats him and his government a great deal better than did his
predecessors, he complains frequently about the attacks on him, which,
according to him, are aiming at his "human dignity." Bekesi claimed that
Gyula Horn had never quite believed that his program was the only program
which can be followed. That he deep down felt that there had to be an easier
way to solve the problems instead of strict austerity. The Hungarian welfare
state has some features which even the most advanced western European
countries cannot afford. For example, no university tuition and stipend to
all; very early retirement; 75% of pay for two or three years after every new
baby for the mother (I am not exactly sure of the figures, but something
similar to this), and so on and so forth. This welfare state must be
partially dismantled. That is what euphemistically is called in Hungary the
reform of the welfare state. This is, of course, politically a very dangerous
business: we are talking about entitlements.

The newest development which I find very dangerous is the courting of the
right-wing parties the MSZP and attacking the SZDSZ for the "failed" economic
program. (The fact is that Bekesi's program was never in place, because Horn
and others sabotaged it from day one.) Both the left and the right are
against foreign investments and foreigners in general, and the majority of
the population actually feels the same way. A so-called political scientist,
Bela Pokol, who seems to be misunderstanding the role of political
scientists, has been working furiously trying to bring the right and the left
together and suggesting that the MSZP should simply dump the SZDSZ.

I may add that the Hungarian population doesn't seem to understand the
gravity of the economic situation. Although in comparison to other
neighboring countries, they are doing quite well, they are dead against
austerity program which would affect them. Therefore, Bekesi was quite
unpopular and many people are mighty happy that he is gone. Meanwhile Gyula
Horn remains quite popular because he is unwilling or unable to explain the
his constituency that "sacrifices" must be made.

Where should the country go from here? What do you think?

Eva Balogh

 wrote:

: A so-called political scientist,
: Bela Pokol...has been working furiously trying to bring the right and
: the left together and suggesting that the MSZP should simply dump the
: SZDSZ.

It seems to me that breaking the coalition is the first step to
breaking
the government, so why not favor SZDSZ in the opposition?  Have I
missed
something?

--Greg

This reply came directly to me:

: The so-called popular-nationalist forces, now joined by Fidesz, had
: had long running resentment, up to and in many cases including
: outright hatred against SZDSZ. [Currently]...the fall of this
: government would almost inevitably lead to some coalition of the
: populist-rightists with the leftist populists - a most unfortunate
: possibility for the country, IMHO...

Fair enough.  But sometimes the fear of God--or in this case perhaps
of Marx--has to be put into governments before hard decisions can be
made.  Let MSzP ponder a while on going it alone.

Unfortunate possibilities, IMHO, always have to be weighed against
unfortunate facts: there's a mess and bringing pressure on the parties
responsibile seems in order...

--Greg

What has happened to Fideaz?  When I interned with them last year, everyone I k
new seemed to be very liberal.  unfortunately, i keep hearing stories of Fidesz
 moving into camp with MDF.  Is this all Orban's doing?

___MAGYAR ELEKTRONIKUS TOZSDE____________________________HU-ISSN_1216-0229
HUNGARIAN ELECTRONIC EXCHANGE     copyright  1990.

                           ToZSDENAPLo
                         Vetes elott eladni!
    Arfolyamcsokkenessel zart a marciusi hataridore szallitando
kukorica a budapesti tozsden. Jegyzese a korabbi, tonnankent 10800
forintos szintrol 10200 forintra esett. A majusi kukorica 11400
forintos tonnankenti arfolyama azonos szinten tartott maradt.
A termelok figyelmebe ajanlom az uj termesu, oktoberi kukorica aranak
alakulasat. Nos, marcius elejere ez az arfolyam 10700 forintra allt
be. Akinek ez az ar megfelel, mar most, vetes elott eladathatja
kukoricajat a tozsden: a bevetele biztositott. Ha viszont nem talal
vevore, az feler egy figyelmeztetessel. Akkor mar jobb, ha mast
termel helyette.
A novemberi arfolyam 11150 forinton allt februar vegen. Ezen a
szinten talakoztak a vevok es eladok arajanlatai, igy egy
kiegyensolyozott piac alakult ki. A decemberi kukroicat dragabban,
tonnakent 11500 forinton kinaltak, sot vasaroltak is. Igaz, ebben az
arban mar a tarolasi koltsegek is kozrejatszottak.
    Erdekes, hogy a jelenlegi, alacsonyra nyomott, kilonkent 22-24
forintos malmi lisztarak mellett a marciusi szallitasu malmibuza
13100 forintrol 13350 forintra emelkedett, majd vegul is ezen a
szinten zart. (A szallitas honapjaban termeszetesen mar nem valtozhat
az arfolyam. A tozsde szigoru szabalyai garantaljak, hogy az uzlet
-az eredetileg kialkudott aron- mindenkeppen letrejojjon).
A majusi buza a tozsdeparketten tonnakent 13600 forintos szintet ert
el. A juliusi ujtermesu buza arfolyama egy ideig tonnankent 10700
forinton allt, majd 10600 forintra csokkent. Az augusztusi malmibuza
februar vegen 10750 forinton allt, de ez a jegyzes is 10600 forintra
gyengult. Az oktoberi hataridore 11250 forinton, majd 11500 forintos
aron szulettek uzletkotesek. A decmberi tonnankent arfolyam 12300
forinton tartott maradt.
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