en is lattom--berci

In article >, 
(George Nolte) says:
>Latja ezt valaki, aki nem magyarorszagi szervert hasznal?
	Franciaorszagba is megerkezett, Rennes-be !

Udv, Gabor

Szervusz,
at the Hungarian Festival in New Brunswick we have met several members 
from the New Brunswick Chapter of AAYH . Let me pass the information to 
you about them, as some of you might not be aware of their or 
AAYH's other chapters' existence. For more information you can send a 
mail directly to their email address 
mailto: 
or to the 
mailto: 
list. 
They have established a home page on the WWW, that can be reached under 
the following URL :
http://www.jvnc.net/~kerekes/
Good luck,
Gotthard 

--
personal email,          mailto:
Hungarian-American list, mailto:  
WWW,                       http://www.glue.umd.edu/~gotthard

Denise noe asked:
>Has there been any fairly recent work on Elizabeth Bathory?

Peter Katalin
 A csejtei varurno: Bathori Erzsebet
(A csejtei várúrnő: Báthori Erzsébet)
Helikon Kiado 1985
111 p.

So one more thing which we Hungarians and Romanians have
common: you have Dracula we have missus Bathory...

She was a member of one of the most powerful and richest
Hungarian family of her time, the Bathory clan. The family
was quite intensive if you know what I mean;  her parents
were also relatives.
She had a bad marriage, five kids, became widow in 1604.
The investigation started in 1610 and she was sentenced
in 1614  to stay in her castle for life. 

She was sadist but she rather watched than took in part
the show. Her hobby started right in her husbands life who
stayed away a lot because he was general and so she had
to find her way alone to amuse herself.

Her sadism was sexually motivated as the books writer
concludes. At the beginning her game was not lethal un-
til later she drew into helpers.

Her habit was quite known for her environment but nobody
cared as long as she sticked to young serf women. She had
some older maids whose work were to recruit and torture
the girls.

The problem started when she got a liking to torture the
noble girls who were sent to her court to get education.
When some such girls dissapeared the indignant relatives
denounced her at the King who launched the investigation.

In the book there are some original evidence of eyewitt-
neses and those maids -17. century Hungarian which is
quite funny to read - and the stuff is *brutal*. She even
took girls with her whe she went to travel and during the
journey they played in the coach. When the girl died they
promptly stopped to dig the corpse then  started  to work
on the next girl.

Tamás

Dorin Taranul writes:
> I can't speak for others, nor  am I responsible for their deeds, but,
> as an ethnic Romanian, I felt insulted and ashamed by this posting.

> I deeply love my nation, its tradition, culture, history and land in
> which it was born and dwells. But, I also understand that we,
> Romanians, do not live in a void, that there are other nationalities
> which live with or next to us, that we are all part of the mankind
> family, and that, as children of the same God, we are all entitled to
> the same rights and aspirations. And to this end, I believe that
> respect for others, is respect for ourselves.

> So, at least as far as this Romanian is concerned, let me assure all
> my Magyar friends that I do not partake in the hatred spilled by the
> above posting, and that I hope that more or my Romanian brothers and
> sisters will join me in trying to put an end to this ethnic bickering
> nonsense.

> "If not us, then who? If not now, then when?"

> Dorin Taranul

Kudos for Dorin. It is possible to disagree on many items without attacking 
people for being who or what they are. Everybody should respect if nothing 
else, the humanness of the other being. I have had a chance to travel all 
over the world and I have found that the proportion of good people is 
fairly equal all over the world.

Regards,Jeliko.

> In article >, 02 > wrote:
> >
> > I may add that after the congress of RMDSZ there's another anti-Hungarian 
> > campaign (not the least the first one this year) in Rumania and this time 
> > (maybe as a prelude to the upcoming  (presidental) elections) even those 
> > Rumanian political groups seem to 
> > "join in" the Hungarian-bashing, like liberal Peasants' Party, who have 
> > refrained from chauvinism so far.     
 

Talking about chuvinism, I would like to give you maghiars a little insight
in the situation of the two counties, Harghita and Covasna, where the
Secui are in majority.
My personal experience as well as all the relatives or friends that I 
talked to who have been there recall at least one incident in the past 
20 years when they were refused service by local Secui when addressed
in Romanian.
 
There is a long way to go until tesions subside but the local Secui
displayed and continue to display "chauvinist" behaviour who will
only intensify the dislike between the two peoples.

In today's context "ethnic authonomy" will only widen the gap and make 
matters  worse.

Adrian

Hello everyone,
I'm constructing an analytical paper on the Hungarian language
and how social issues are affecting it.  How has the language changed
from 10 years ago?  Do you think its changing right now and if so
why?  Though I lived in Budapest for approximately 10 months, my
Hungarian isn't very good so if you could assist me in any possible
way please write me back. 
	Koszonok
	
	Nikolaj Nielsen
	
	

In article >,  (Vladimir Drobot
) writes:
 (Krzysztof Wroblewski) writes:
>
>
>>It is difficult to find out when the first Jew arrived to Poland. They have 
>>always been there. Nobody specially invited them nor tried to expell them.
>
>
>>If you know who invited them I would greatly appreciate this information. And
>
>While you are at it, find out also who invited Poles to Poland
>
>Vladimir Drobot
>
That's a toughie, but the Vistula River Basin is a leading candidate
among other regions in Eastern/Central Europe for the title, "Homeland
of the Slavs", based on linguistic and archaeological data. We know Slavs
have lived in the present RP's territory since at least around A.D. 500, 
and possibly as early as 500 B.C. - although the latter date is heavily
disputed. There is evidence of several other groups living in or moving
through Poland prior to the Slavic period, including Celts, Balts, Germanic
tribes, Iranian tribes, and Urallic groups (i.e. Finno-Ugraic, or "proto-
Finns and Estonians"). Around the time of the recognition of Poland by the
Christian West (tenth century), Polish and other Slavic tribes occupied
most of modern Poland except Warmia, E. Prussia, and western Pomerania.
Slavic settlements extended as far west as the right bank of the Elbe, 
although a century earlier Charlemagne had devastated these tribes and
subjugated them. 
     As far as the Jews are concerned, Bohemian-Czech records of the ninth
century mention Jewish traders from north of the Carpathians, and some
written communication exists among Bohemian Jews of the tenth and eleventh
centuries mentioning religious disputes among/between Jews north of the
Carpathians. While the state that would eventually become known as Poland
was the first stable, enduring state to be founded in the region, (perhaps
by the leader or warlord "Ziemomysl" mentioned in Bohemian chronicals around
the latter half of the ninth century?), it was by no means nearly as stable
as its neighbors, and in fact had little contact with them until well into
the tenth century - and that was mostly contact of the hostile kind. Why
would Jews choose to live in a state that was highly volatile internally and
externally, with only the most primitive of economies? It is certain that
Jews did live in Poland from the earliest days of its conception, but Poland
(compared to her neighbors) had little to offer Jews (either those seeking
refuge or following trade) even after Mieszko I's diplomatic coup of 966. 
Most Polish Jews will trace their origins to the beginning of the massive
migrations of first Bohemian, then German [Ashkenazi] Jews after the thirteenth
century to Poland. Although this event is highly romanticized today, (see the
Jan Matejko portrayal of the "event"), this does not mean it never took place
- in fact, until now, I'd never heard of a doubting opinion, Polish or Jewish.

For some interesting reading on Polish-Jewish relations, there's a great book
by Magdalena Opalski and Israel Bartel called "The Failed Brotherhood", on
the strange twists Polish-Jewish relations took in the nineteenth century, 
through the rise of modern Polish nationalism and the 1863 Rebellion. 


                                             - Tomek Jankowski
                                             University of Buffalo
                                         

Dear Tams, has this book been translated into English? If not, would it be
possible for you to give me the pages where the blood-drinking/bathing
legend is debunked so I can have someone who knows Hungarian translate
that part for me?
Thank you very, very much for the help you've already given.